What do you make of the verse in Quran that says something about the male's fluid coming from between his back and ribs???? I tried to ask this question here but it got blocked, and I can't really find a satisfying answer.
Question about a verse from the Qur'an
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Re: Addicted to Islam?
Greetings and welcome to our forum
First, of all we wish to commend you on the interest you have taken to study Islam and appreciate the value of its teachings and its call towards devotion to the One God, Glorified and Exalted is He, who created us all with a sublime purpose. May God guide you in your devotion to Him and guide you to the truth.
As for your question on verses 86:6-7, the Qur'an states that man has been created from that which emanates from between the sulb and the tarâib. The sulb refers to the loins of the man and the taraib refers to the abdomen of the female. This is how the terms have been defined in the classical dictionary Al-Qamus by Al-Fayruzabadi and in the Tafsir of Ibn Kathir, both written centuries ago when there would have been no concern for the scientific implications of these terms!
To quote IslamToday fatwâ committee:
http://www.islamicboard.com/152142-post6.html
As for your studies on Islam, we highly encourage you make use of the excellent resources listed here:
http://www.islamicboard.com/discover-islam/13373-studying-islam-list-resources.html
If you have any further questions please do not hesitate to ask.
Regards
Greetings and welcome to our forum
First, of all we wish to commend you on the interest you have taken to study Islam and appreciate the value of its teachings and its call towards devotion to the One God, Glorified and Exalted is He, who created us all with a sublime purpose. May God guide you in your devotion to Him and guide you to the truth.
As for your question on verses 86:6-7, the Qur'an states that man has been created from that which emanates from between the sulb and the tarâib. The sulb refers to the loins of the man and the taraib refers to the abdomen of the female. This is how the terms have been defined in the classical dictionary Al-Qamus by Al-Fayruzabadi and in the Tafsir of Ibn Kathir, both written centuries ago when there would have been no concern for the scientific implications of these terms!
To quote IslamToday fatwâ committee:
It is inconceivable that the true word of Allah could ever contradict scientific fact, since the universe is Allah's creation, and Allah fully knows what He created. A Muslim, when faced with what appears to be a contradiction between the Qur’ân and a scientific fact knows there can only be two possibilities:
It is an inarguable fact that sperm is created in the testicles. Therefore, we must make sure we are understanding these verses correctly. We must look carefully at the verses to ascertain exactly what the Qur’ân is saying and – more importantly – what it is not saying.
There are some serious problems with this translation and the assumptions made therein.
To begin with, these verses say nothing whatsoever about the creation of sperm or the creation of anything else. Consequently, they do not inform us of where the creation of sperm takes place. They merely say that the substances under discussion come out form the places being described. The word being used is “yakhruj” meaning “to exit, leave, come out, emerge”. It in no way implies anything related to creation or origination.
Secondly, the phrase “mâ’ dâfiq” (emitted fluid) is not restricted in meaning to sperm but is used in Arabic for both the sperm and the egg. Ibn Kathîr, in his commentary on this verse, writes: “It emanates from the man and the woman, and with Allah’s permission, the child comes forth as a product of both.”
Thirdly, the words translated as “backbone” (sulb) and “ribs” (tarâ’ib) are not understood in Arabic to belong to the same person. Arabs understand the “sulb” to refer to a part of the male body and the “tarâ’ib” to a part of the female. Ibn Kathîr states: “It refers to the ‘sulb’ of the man and the ‘tarâ’ib’ of the woman, which is the area of her chest.” He then quotes this interpretation on the authority of the Prophet’s companion Ibn `Abbâs. This same understanding is given in all the major classical works of Qur’anic commentary.
Moreover, the word “sulb” should not necessarily be translated as “backbone”. This word has many possible meanings and backbone is only one of them. It is also quite commonly used to mean the loins of a man. This is how it is used elsewhere in the Qur’ân. Allah says: “Prohibited to you (for marriage) are…wives of your sons proceeding from your loins (aslâb, the plural of sulb).” [Sûrah al-Nisâ’: 23] There can be no problem with sperm coming out from the area of a man's loins.
Likewise, when we look at the word being translated as “ribs” (tarâ’ib, the plural of tarîbah) we find that it is used linguistically for the general are of the chest and the abdomen. In al-Qâmûs, the famous classical dictionary of al-Fayrûzabâdî it is defined as a number of things: “the bones of the chest or what comes after the two collarbones or what comes between the collarbones and the chest or the four ribs to the right of the chest or the four ribs to the left of the chest or the hands, eyes and feet or the collarbones.” Some Companions of the Prophet (peace be upon him) and some Successors had also provided many possible meanings, like the lower ribs and al-Dahhâk’s statement that it is the area between the breasts and feet and the eyes (a mere indication of centrality).
This word clearly has a very broad and diverse definition. It is so ambiguous a word that the Companions of the Prophet (peace be upon him) could not give it a precise definition. Scholars of Qur’ânic commentary have consistently admitted to there being at least three different possible meanings for this word as it is used in the verse. This is an admission that they do not know for certain what the tarâ’ib are, except that they generally agree it refers to an area of the woman’s body. It can apply to any region nearing the ribcage. Therefore, the area of the ovaries, the fallopian tubes, or the uterus can easily fit into the general area that is being indicated by these verses.
What we are dealing with here is a gross error in translation and not a scientific error at all.
This should answer your question. It should be noted that there are other explanations and interpretations of these verses that Muslim writers and scholars have proposed, of which we have quoted some here:1. That which is being construed as a scientific “fact” is not in actuality a fact.
2. The verse that is being construed as being in conflict with science is being misinterpreted, misapplied, or misunderstood.
Any claim being made that there is a contradiction between science and the Qur’ân has to be evaluated individually. The factuality of the scientific claim needs to be assessed as well as the true meaning of the verse that is supposedly at variance with it.2. The verse that is being construed as being in conflict with science is being misinterpreted, misapplied, or misunderstood.
It is an inarguable fact that sperm is created in the testicles. Therefore, we must make sure we are understanding these verses correctly. We must look carefully at the verses to ascertain exactly what the Qur’ân is saying and – more importantly – what it is not saying.
There are some serious problems with this translation and the assumptions made therein.
To begin with, these verses say nothing whatsoever about the creation of sperm or the creation of anything else. Consequently, they do not inform us of where the creation of sperm takes place. They merely say that the substances under discussion come out form the places being described. The word being used is “yakhruj” meaning “to exit, leave, come out, emerge”. It in no way implies anything related to creation or origination.
Secondly, the phrase “mâ’ dâfiq” (emitted fluid) is not restricted in meaning to sperm but is used in Arabic for both the sperm and the egg. Ibn Kathîr, in his commentary on this verse, writes: “It emanates from the man and the woman, and with Allah’s permission, the child comes forth as a product of both.”
Thirdly, the words translated as “backbone” (sulb) and “ribs” (tarâ’ib) are not understood in Arabic to belong to the same person. Arabs understand the “sulb” to refer to a part of the male body and the “tarâ’ib” to a part of the female. Ibn Kathîr states: “It refers to the ‘sulb’ of the man and the ‘tarâ’ib’ of the woman, which is the area of her chest.” He then quotes this interpretation on the authority of the Prophet’s companion Ibn `Abbâs. This same understanding is given in all the major classical works of Qur’anic commentary.
Moreover, the word “sulb” should not necessarily be translated as “backbone”. This word has many possible meanings and backbone is only one of them. It is also quite commonly used to mean the loins of a man. This is how it is used elsewhere in the Qur’ân. Allah says: “Prohibited to you (for marriage) are…wives of your sons proceeding from your loins (aslâb, the plural of sulb).” [Sûrah al-Nisâ’: 23] There can be no problem with sperm coming out from the area of a man's loins.
Likewise, when we look at the word being translated as “ribs” (tarâ’ib, the plural of tarîbah) we find that it is used linguistically for the general are of the chest and the abdomen. In al-Qâmûs, the famous classical dictionary of al-Fayrûzabâdî it is defined as a number of things: “the bones of the chest or what comes after the two collarbones or what comes between the collarbones and the chest or the four ribs to the right of the chest or the four ribs to the left of the chest or the hands, eyes and feet or the collarbones.” Some Companions of the Prophet (peace be upon him) and some Successors had also provided many possible meanings, like the lower ribs and al-Dahhâk’s statement that it is the area between the breasts and feet and the eyes (a mere indication of centrality).
This word clearly has a very broad and diverse definition. It is so ambiguous a word that the Companions of the Prophet (peace be upon him) could not give it a precise definition. Scholars of Qur’ânic commentary have consistently admitted to there being at least three different possible meanings for this word as it is used in the verse. This is an admission that they do not know for certain what the tarâ’ib are, except that they generally agree it refers to an area of the woman’s body. It can apply to any region nearing the ribcage. Therefore, the area of the ovaries, the fallopian tubes, or the uterus can easily fit into the general area that is being indicated by these verses.
What we are dealing with here is a gross error in translation and not a scientific error at all.
http://www.islamicboard.com/152142-post6.html
As for your studies on Islam, we highly encourage you make use of the excellent resources listed here:
http://www.islamicboard.com/discover-islam/13373-studying-islam-list-resources.html
If you have any further questions please do not hesitate to ask.
Regards
Re: Addicted to Islam?
Thank you very much for the reply. I tried to do search but couldn't find the answer on this board. I am a medical student so this verse was very important to me, after going through months of anatomy I see now the problems is with translation - These English translators really need to watch themselves.
Thank you very much for the reply. I tried to do search but couldn't find the answer on this board. I am a medical student so this verse was very important to me, after going through months of anatomy
I see now the problems is with translation - These English translators really need to watch themselves.
scentsofjannah
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Re: Addicted to Islam?
Dr Zakir Naik answered this question many times..i'll post his reply some other time InshaAllah (God Willing)
Dr Zakir Naik answered this question many times..i'll post his reply some other time InshaAllah (God Willing)
All the Christian Missionaries and other enemies of Islam most often allege that Quran is wrong and unscientific when it comes to describing the emergence of sperm in our bodies. Their allegation is that Quran in Surah Tariq says that Allah says he created man from a sperm that emerges between backbone and ribs.
Their baseless allegation is that it is a clear contradiction that goes against Science. They say Science tells us the sperm production happens in the testis of a male person not between the ribs and backbone, and therefore the Quran has a biological error contained in it.
Let’s analyse and realize whether they are getting it wrong or the Quran really has a mistake in describing the production of sperm in males.
“Man should see what he has been created from? He has been created from a gushing fluid, emerging from between the loins and ribs” The Quran, Chapter 86, Verse 5-7.
Firstly, they are all wrong who allege that the Quran says it is the sperm. It isn’t the sperm the Quran is talking about. If it were, Quran would have used the word Nutfah. The Quran has instead used the word gushing fluid that could possibly be both fluid of women and men.
There is nothing like a scientific contradiction in it. It would have been a clear contradiction if the Quran had used the word Sperm translated Nutfah in the Arabic language. So, it could mean fluid of both men and women. You cannot say Quran specifically points toward sperm production taking place between ribs and backbone.
The Arabic word Sulb also means loins – an area of the body between the pelvis and the waist, and sometimes it includes genitals as well. The fact that the word Sulb does indeed refer to the loins because has used the plural (Aslab) of Sulb in the Surah Nisa, verse4-23 as well. So, the word loin is the correct word that can be used in translations. So, we can conclude that there is nothing in this particular verse of Quran that goes against sciences. In fact, gets support from the science because it is the loins from where does sperm form and originate not the backbone.
Source- https://www.kalameilahi.com/quran-on-sperm-production-islam-misconceptions-debunked/
Their baseless allegation is that it is a clear contradiction that goes against Science. They say Science tells us the sperm production happens in the testis of a male person not between the ribs and backbone, and therefore the Quran has a biological error contained in it.
Let’s analyse and realize whether they are getting it wrong or the Quran really has a mistake in describing the production of sperm in males.
“Man should see what he has been created from? He has been created from a gushing fluid, emerging from between the loins and ribs” The Quran, Chapter 86, Verse 5-7.
Firstly, they are all wrong who allege that the Quran says it is the sperm. It isn’t the sperm the Quran is talking about. If it were, Quran would have used the word Nutfah. The Quran has instead used the word gushing fluid that could possibly be both fluid of women and men.
There is nothing like a scientific contradiction in it. It would have been a clear contradiction if the Quran had used the word Sperm translated Nutfah in the Arabic language. So, it could mean fluid of both men and women. You cannot say Quran specifically points toward sperm production taking place between ribs and backbone.
The Arabic word Sulb also means loins – an area of the body between the pelvis and the waist, and sometimes it includes genitals as well. The fact that the word Sulb does indeed refer to the loins because has used the plural (Aslab) of Sulb in the Surah Nisa, verse4-23 as well. So, the word loin is the correct word that can be used in translations. So, we can conclude that there is nothing in this particular verse of Quran that goes against sciences. In fact, gets support from the science because it is the loins from where does sperm form and originate not the backbone.
Source- https://www.kalameilahi.com/quran-on-sperm-production-islam-misconceptions-debunked/
Abz2000
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At-Tariq 86:5
فَلْيَنظُرِ ٱلْإِنسَٰنُ مِمَّ خُلِقَ
Now let man but think from what he is created!
At-Tariq 86:6
خُلِقَ مِن مَّآءٍ دَافِقٍ
He is created from a drop emitted-
At-Tariq 86:7
يَخْرُجُ مِنۢ بَيْنِ ٱلصُّلْبِ وَٱلتَّرَآئِبِ
Proceeding from between the backbone and the ribs:
At-Tariq 86:8
إِنَّهُۥ عَلَىٰ رَجْعِهِۦ لَقَادِرٌ
Surely (Allah) is able to bring him back (to life)!
----------------
The verses describe the process.
It actually means "comes out" or "goes out" in imperfect tense
And the subject is Al insaan (the human being).
(The translator can easily have a wrong idea and join it in translation - especially given all the confused attempts to explain it away that they may have come across).
The verses are separate, and it's one of the Quranic styles (reading the Quran further should confirm that).
You'll notice that verse #5 mentions the question, verse #6 the initiation, verse #7 the delivery from the womb, and verse #8 the resurrection.
Its very obvious and simple when you look at the pattern of prose.
It is only when the separate verses are recited in a joined fashion that it appears confusing.
See also:
Saba' 34:2
يَعْلَمُ مَا يَلِجُ فِى ٱلْأَرْضِ وَمَا يَخْرُجُ مِنْهَا وَمَا يَنزِلُ مِنَ ٱلسَّمَآءِ وَمَا يَعْرُجُ فِيهَاۚ وَهُوَ ٱلرَّحِيمُ ٱلْغَفُورُ
English - Yusuf Ali
He knows all that goes into the earth, and all that comes out thereof ; all that comes down from the sky and all that ascends thereto and He is the Most Merciful, the Oft-Forgiving.
And
Al-A'la 87:4
وَٱلَّذِىٓ أَخْرَجَ ٱلْمَرْعَىٰ
And Who bringeth out the (green and luscious) pasture,
Al-A'la 87:5
فَجَعَلَهُۥ غُثَآءً أَحْوَىٰ
And then doth make it (but) swarthy stubble.
get Quran App: https://gtaf.org/apps/quran
#GreentechApps
فَلْيَنظُرِ ٱلْإِنسَٰنُ مِمَّ خُلِقَ
Now let man but think from what he is created!
At-Tariq 86:6
خُلِقَ مِن مَّآءٍ دَافِقٍ
He is created from a drop emitted-
At-Tariq 86:7
يَخْرُجُ مِنۢ بَيْنِ ٱلصُّلْبِ وَٱلتَّرَآئِبِ
Proceeding from between the backbone and the ribs:
At-Tariq 86:8
إِنَّهُۥ عَلَىٰ رَجْعِهِۦ لَقَادِرٌ
Surely (Allah) is able to bring him back (to life)!
----------------
The verses describe the process.
It actually means "comes out" or "goes out" in imperfect tense
And the subject is Al insaan (the human being).
(The translator can easily have a wrong idea and join it in translation - especially given all the confused attempts to explain it away that they may have come across).
The verses are separate, and it's one of the Quranic styles (reading the Quran further should confirm that).
You'll notice that verse #5 mentions the question, verse #6 the initiation, verse #7 the delivery from the womb, and verse #8 the resurrection.
Its very obvious and simple when you look at the pattern of prose.
It is only when the separate verses are recited in a joined fashion that it appears confusing.
See also:
Saba' 34:2
يَعْلَمُ مَا يَلِجُ فِى ٱلْأَرْضِ وَمَا يَخْرُجُ مِنْهَا وَمَا يَنزِلُ مِنَ ٱلسَّمَآءِ وَمَا يَعْرُجُ فِيهَاۚ وَهُوَ ٱلرَّحِيمُ ٱلْغَفُورُ
English - Yusuf Ali
He knows all that goes into the earth, and all that comes out thereof ; all that comes down from the sky and all that ascends thereto and He is the Most Merciful, the Oft-Forgiving.
And
Al-A'la 87:4
وَٱلَّذِىٓ أَخْرَجَ ٱلْمَرْعَىٰ
And Who bringeth out the (green and luscious) pasture,
Al-A'la 87:5
فَجَعَلَهُۥ غُثَآءً أَحْوَىٰ
And then doth make it (but) swarthy stubble.
get Quran App: https://gtaf.org/apps/quran
#GreentechApps
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